The Carnivorous Diet & Your Thyroid
Wednesday, November 4, 2009 at 10:50PM
The single biggest hurdle I had to leap through to begin my carnivorous adventure was the fear of "low-carb induced hypothyroidism". When I began to explore research on the subject, I hit a brick wall of alarmist forum posts and erroneous pub-med articles of varied importance. But the consensus was clear, you must consume dietary carbohydrates to keep your thyroid healthy.
Over the years I learned to listen to my body and it was clearly telling me to restrict carbohydrates. I finally gave in, managed to ignore the fear mongering of conventional wisdom and dropped carbohydrates completely.
The question however is still valid.
Does a carnivorous diet positively or negatively affect the thyroid gland?
There isn't much data pertaining to the thyroid health of subjects who ate close to or a completely carnivorous diet, so I'll be dipping into ketogenic diet and fasting research. The difference being that a ketogenic diet consists of about ~50g of carbohydrates a day with the remaining calories coming from fat and protein. From here on out I will use the terms "carnivorous diet" and "ketogenic diet" interchangeably since in all likelihood they aren't much different.
First lets explore the reasons why we want a healthy thyroid. Here is a quick overview of the functions this butterfly shaped gland performs.
- Metabolic Rate - When people say "metabolism", they might as well be saying "thyroid". Within the endocrine system, the thyroid along with the adrenal glands are the biological engines that ultimately direct our hormonal metabolism.
- Setting Proteins - The thyroid can increase and decrease the rate of protein degradation.
- Creation of Thyroxine (T4) - The thyroid produces a couple of different hormones, the most important being T4 and…
- Creation of Triiodothyronine (T3) - T3 is the metabolically active version of T4. T3 is responsible for the thyroids metabolic influencing affects while thyroxine (T4) is considered to be a storage form of T3 waiting to be converted into T3 by the liver.
A carnivorous diet is very similar to the metabolic state the body is in when fasting. Without discussing too much of the technical jargon, a carnivorous diet will lower blood sugar, lower basal insulin, decrease inflammation, balance hormones, reduce oxidative stress and support the immune system. Fasting is the only other method that can match the incredible health promoting effects of a dietary decrease in carbohydrate consumption. The downside to fasting being that you have to eat sometime!
So what happens happens to our thyroid when we fast?
In short, it slows down. And it especially slows down when you decrease calories in tandem.
So what gives? Isn't the slow down of the thyroid what we're trying to avoid?
This is were the forum posting alarmists get it wrong. Fortunately the decline of serum T3 due to fasting is not associated with the disease state known as hypothyroidism.
"Despite the fall in T3 levels, clinical hypothyroidism does not develop. Thyrotropin values do not rise, as might be expected in primary thyroid dysfunction: in fact basal TSH concentrations may decrease in short-term fasting or remain unchanged in prolonged (more than three weeks) fasting. In addition, TSH response to thyrotropin releasing hormone infusions may be blunted or unchanged."
While I'm not always a fan of his work, Lyle McDonald wrote a fantastic book on ketosis. Lyle's research echoes the study above demonstrating that while low-carb diets induce lower numbers of the thyroid hormone T3, it is not related to the disease condition known as hypothyroidism.
Hypothyroidism and euthyroid stress syndrome (ESS) There are two common syndromes associated with low levels of T3 which need to be differentiated from one another. Hypothyroidism is a disease characterized by higher than normal thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) and lower levels of T3 and T4. The symptoms of this disease include fatigue and a low metabolic rate.
The decrease in T3 due to hypothyroidism must be contrasted to the decrease seen during dieting or carbohydrate restriction. Low levels of T3 with normal levels of T4 and TSH (as seen in ketogenic dieting) is known clinically as euthyroid stress syndrome (ESS) and is not associated with the metabolic derangements seen in hypothyroidism (1). The drop in T3 does not appear to be linked to a drop in metabolic rate during a ketogenic diet (17,52).
As with other hormones in the body (for example insulin), the decrease in circulating T3 levels may be compensated for by an increase in receptor activity and/or number (1). This has been shown to occur in mononuclear blood cells but has not been studied in human muscle or fat cells (53). So while T3 does go down on a ketogenic diet, this does not appear to be the reason for a decrease in metabolic rate.
Lyle McDonald (1998) The Ketogenic Diet: A Complete Guide for the Dieter and Practitioner (pp. 48)
The decrease in T3 during fasting is the body adapting to its metabolic condition in order to preserve muscle mass and conserve energy. Remember, the thyroid is also responsible for rate of protein catabolism. The body being as smart as it is, down regulates the thyroid to conserve fuel and protect lean mass.
There is no better example than the steroid abusing muscle heads on the bodybuilding forums I used to frequent. Those who aggressively used Cytomel (prescription T3) for weight loss during a "cut" had less than stellar experiences. I remember vivid accounts from unhappy forum members who used Cytomel for too long and wasted away, due to excessive T3.
The Autoimmune Connection
The most common type of thyroid dysregulation is known as Hashimoto's thyroiditis. This disorder is characterized by the body becoming allergic to thyroid hormones. The body produces antibodies that begin to attack its own thyroid tissue. While little is known about the specific origins of Hashimoto's we can confidently say that ridding the diet of grains (gluten specifically) is of paramount importance.
Gluten is a pro-inflammatory protein found in "heart healthy" whole grains as well as most processed foods. The autoimmune disease, celiac disease, is characterized by eating these foods. Can we stop a second? A disease that increases cancer, osteoporosis, thyroid disease, multiple sclerosis, rheumatoid arthritis, and neurodegenerative states is caused by eating a food that our government tells us to eat 6-11 servings of. Shocking.
Besides avoiding grains, which is done naturally on a carnivorous regime, getting adequate Vitamin D is becoming more and more important. Carnivorous subscribers don't have a bulletproof vest for this one. I don't like recommending supplements, but like Dr. Harris of the PaNu Weblog says:
"Vitamin D is replacement, not supplementation. We are trying to get our 25(OH)D levels up to paleolithic normal which will be above the Neolithic normal."
For an overview, let's head over to Animal Pharm run by the exuberant Dr. BG. If you haven't already subscribed, she is a hoot and you should immediately.
"How to Stop the Autoimmune Process of Hashimoto's
When one of our organs is jacked how do we recover it? Can we induce our immune system to heal and restore function? Certainly! With time, appropriate nutrients and stimulus, I believe depending on the extent of the incurred damage, our bodies have the capacity to regenerate itself. With Vitamin D repletion and Wheat-Cessation, I have observed a trend of improved TSH (including my own from 1.3-1.9 to 1.0 when my 25(OH)D stays above 60 ng/ml). Why? Vitamin D interacts intimately with thyroid, vitamin A/carenoid and other steroid hormone controls, including the sex hormones.
- These below nutrients and lifestyle changes have been shown to aid the Thyroid to heal and restore functionality:
- stopping wheat which triggers our immune systems: innate+humoral
- stopping wheat which triggers genetic expression of stress responses
- stopping wheat which results in rapid rises of insulin
- stopping gluten/wheat/barley/rye
- stopping beans, peanuts, legumes (lectins)
- stopping dairy (which contain opioid-like proteins like wheat)
- stopping grains (rice, corn, etc) -- which are all grass-derived (*ha * I didn't say WEEDS but that's what I mean)
- proper nutrients which are the building-blocks of the Thyroid Gland and Thyroid Enzymes: proteins (taurine, leucine, arginine, OKG, L-carnitine, etc), minerals (IODINE, Mg, Zn, Se, Chromium, Bo, etc)
- B-vitamins (including α-lipoic acid)
- Vitamin D3 (goal 25(OH)D=70 ng/ml)
- Vitamin E (tocopherols, tocotrienols)
- Vitamin K1 K2
- Vitamin A
- Carotenoids (grassfed meat, wild seafood, Krill oil/Astaxanthin)
- EPA + DHA (ditto) -- high dose if extreme inflammation is present
- Antioxidants (Flavonoids, CoQ10, ALCAR/α-LA, Pycnogenol, etc)
- Avoid dietary and environmental toxins (nitrite preservatives, plastic, petroleum, bisphenol, heavy metals (Lead, Mercury), endocrine disrupters, pesticides, dioxins, etc)"
The Adrenal Connection
The adrenals are star-shaped endocrine glands that sit on top of our kidneys. Their main function is to regulate our stress hormones (cortisol, adrenaline) as well as produce several key sex hormones (DHEA, aldosterone).
A common analogie is as follows:
The thyroid controls the rate at which our motors run when in idle.
The adrenals control the rate at which our motors run when in gear.
If you can't function well in gear (stressed out much?) then naturally your body will slow the motor down so you don't blow a gasket (down regulation of the thyroid).
Excessive cortisol production is what we want to prevent when keeping our adrenal glands healthy. Besides leaving the Crackberry at home, getting good sleep, and having a positive outlook, we can minimize cortisol by regulating our blood sugar.
This is of course is done by carbohydrate restriction. A surge of blood sugar induces the sympathetic nervous system into a state of over-arousal causing the adrenal glands to release adrenaline. This shifts your body into a biological state called "fight or flight". When chronically activated this response rewards us with stress induced eating, anxiety, and insomnia. Don't get me wrong, this evolutionary trait is not dangerous, but it's chronic activation with sugary foods is not what evolution intended.
Dietary fat plays a large supporting role in the health of our adrenal glands. In an experiment Hans Selye, M.D., author of The Stress of Life, exposed a large number of rats to environmental and physical stressors over long periods of time to test the resistance of the animals in repeated intervals.
This is what he wrote:
". . . in one experiment we placed a hundred rats in a refrigerated room where the temperature was near freezing. (This causes the animals stress). Thanks to their fur during the first 48 hours they developed the typical manifestations of the alarm reaction. This was proved by killling ten animals at the end of the second day; all of them had large, fat-free adrenals, small thymuses, and stomach ulcers."
Seyle concludes that the adrenals use large amounts of fat during stress. The reason the adrenal glands are surrounded by fat is in order to have the raw materials to synthesize hormones. When the fat is dried up, from chronic stress, we begin to deteriorate and soon after run into adrenal fatigue. Making an effort to consume plenty of essential fatty acids from grass-fed animals will go a long way in the battle of chronic stress and thyroid problems.
Nutritional Deficiencies
Scientists feed animals high carbohydrate diets to induce vitamin and mineral deficiencies. This is no different in humans. When you're body is under stress (high blood sugar, physical or mental stress) the body body will pull reserves of vitamins (vitamin B5), minerals (zinc), and amino acids (lysine, tyrosine, BCAA's) to combat the stress. Cortisol production requires tyrosine, the same amino acid needed to make thyroxine (T4). The bodies need to make cortisol in a "fight or flight" response will always trump the production of thyroid hormones. Essentially the more cortisol the body produces, the less raw materials available to make thyroid hormones.
As I have mentioned before, animal foods contain all the the amino acids, vitamins and minerals, in a bioavailable form that can sustain anyone indefinitely. Forget the vitamin pills and invest in quality meats from local grass-fed farms.
Environmental
My newest fascination has yet again found its way into my posts. Heavy metals (specifically mercury and lead) have devastating impact on adrenal and thyroid function. It has been demonstrated that mercury vapor accumulates in the adrenal cortex of animals causing a large increase in oxidative stress.
The production of steroid hormones from the adrenal glands is mediated by enzymes. Heavy metals are known to interfere with the action of many of these vital enzymes interupting the downstream of adrenal steroid production. Mercury for instance will disable the enzyme cytochrome P-450 which helps convert cholesterol into pregnenolone, a hormone used to make cortisone, aldosterone and DHEA. This enzyme disruption causes hormonal chaos and will last until measures are taken to get rid of the offending metals.
Conclusion
You cannot correct one gland without having a profound effect on another. This is why I believe that nutrition is the best medicine. Optimizing EVERY system in the body is the only way to get everything back on track. Simply treating low thyroid with medication is silly when we can clearly see that the origin can be multifaceted; rooted in stress, allergies, or even environmental pollution.
If you come away with two things from this post let them be that grains are shit and avoid stress whenever possible. A carnivorous diet poses no threat to anyones thyroid. In fact if you are hypothyroid it's likely that you already eat too many carbohydrates, seeming that most cases are autoimmune or stress related in origin. Carbohydrate consumption in the form of easily digestible sugars and gluten containing grains have a negative impact on the thyroid and adrenal glands. My recommendation would be to minimize or eliminate them completely.
Here is a link to the updated post.
A few forum members have pointed out that very low carbohydrate diets cause an elevation in reverse T3 (inactive T3 thyroid hormone). Apparently this is the reason everyone MUST EAT 50 grams of carbohydrates a day.
I will state here, I am not an expert and I don't pretend to be. My point of interest is that zero-carbers have a high success rate. The proclaimed crashing of the metabolism due to elevated reverse T3 does not jive with the real life results. I also reject the idea that low-carbers need to take thyroid pharmaceuticals to be healthy.
Here is a snippet of the study that's being tossed around.
Starvation has a profound effect on thyroid function, causing a decrease in serumT3 concentration and a reciprocal increase in rT3 level. These changes are due to a selective inhibition of the 5’-monodeiodination of iodothyronines by peripheral tis-sues. Reduction in carbohydrate intake rather than total calorie deprivation appearsto be the determinant factor. These alterations in thyroid function are believed to re-duce the catabolic activity of the organism and thus to conserve energy in the face of decreased calorie intake. Chronic malnutrition is accompanied by similar changes.Over feeding has opposite although transient effects.
But wait, there's more.
To evaluate the effect of caloric restriction and dietary composition on circulating T3 and rT3 obese subjects were studied after 7-18 days of total fasting and while on randomized hypocaloric diets (800 kcal) in which carbohydrate content was varied to provide from 0 to 100% calories. As anticipated, total fasting resulted in a 53% reduction in serum T3 in association with reciprocal 58% increase in rT3. Subjects receiving the no-carbohydrate hypocaloric diets for two weeks demonstrated a similar 47% decline in serum T3 but there was no significant change in rT3 with time. In contrast, the same subjects receiving isocaloric diets containing at least 50 g of carbohydrate showed no significant changes in either T3 or rT3 concentration. The decline in serum T3 during the no-carbohydrate diet correlated significantly with blood glucose and ketones but there was no correlation with insulin or glucagon. We conclude that dietary carbohydrate is an important regulatory factor in T3 production in man. In contrast, rT3 concentration is not significantly affected by changes in dietary carbohydrate. Our data suggest that the rise in serum rT3 during starvation may be related to more severe caloric restriction than that caused by the 800 kcal diet.
What we have here is two seemingly good studies, in complete opposition of each other. The later was specifically conducted with individuals eating a zero carb diet.
Both of these studies do not include what the rest of the diet was composed of. Without knowing what the subjects ate, we are left guessing whether they were predominantly eating fat or protein. Dietary fat, the critical macro nutrient for maintaining the health of the adrenal glands, seems like it could potentially alter any outcome of a stress related study.
Again, blaming the lack of the macro nutrient, that likely was the cause of the derangement in the first place is pretty silly. Those with thyroid disorders should be far more concerned with the intimate connection between insulin resistance, cortisol and reverse T3.
The stress hormone cortisol blocks production of T3 and causes an increase in the production of inactive reverse T3. Elevated levels of insulin lead to the over-arousal of the sympathetic nervous system (SNS). Chronic over stimulation of the SNS leads to the unnecessary production of cortisol, pooped adrenals, and eventually a sluggish thyroid.
HIGH BLOOD SUGAR > INSULIN > SNS HYPER-FUNCTION > ANGIOTENSIN II > ACTH ACTIVATION > UNNECESSARY CORTISOL > REVERSE T3
My stream of thought:
- Ditch the carbs.
- Eat until satisfied.
- Eat mostly fat, moderate protein.
- Get enough sleep.
- Take your vitamin D.
- Stay away from gluten.
- Call it a day.
Adrenals,
Heavy Metals,
Stress,
Thyroid 
Reader Comments (37)
wow that bagel looked might delicious in your pic.. :D jk ..man this is some really great material.
Excellent post Danny...grains are evil and I'm currently recovering from metabolic syndrome so I know personally the damage they deal. I know you're personal history and often until someone is devastated by grains it's hard to comprehend just how damaging they are.
I've been meaning to share this gem for awhile...anyway metabolic syndrome has given me an indirect benefit in that I had diabetic neuropathy (since cured using benfotiamine & lipoic acid) and interestingly my neuropathy will 'flare' when dietary mistakes are made and the worst culprit...you guessed it wheat! So my neuropathy has become like a marker on foods which I should & should not eat and the foods which bring on the worst symptoms are the ones the carnivorous diet community have been telling everyone to avoid.
Also Danny what is you're opinion on nuts? Personally I'm not sold on them and results when eating them are less than stellar.
Like yourself I'm not a success story but am definitely sold on red meat...even over-eating red meat does not cause indigestion or interfere with my sleep...the body seems to deal very well with beef even in comparison to other animal proteins which I experimented with chicken etc
Great post! I've been very low carb, gluten and grain free, sugar-free, PUFA-oil free for almost a full year now, and mostly carnivore for about 6 weeks. And my recent annual physical's blood test came back with a TSH level of 9 indicating my thyroid is probably totally whacked! I've never had results like this in my life, so I've been getting a lot of guff that my low-carb, mostly carnivore lifestyle is what tanked my thyroid, and I better start eating those carbs again immediately!
I've also read many times that you need to stay out of ketosis and keep carbs above 50g daily to prevent thyroid damage, but it almost seems like one of those internet urban legends that you cannot trace back to a scientific source. Still, last year when I was eating garbage all the time my blood tests were normal. <sigh>
Thanks for commenting Charlie.
Thanks for commenting Howard,
It's so interesting to hear you say that. I literally have a very similar thing happen to me when I deviate from pemmican (when I go out for a rare steak with Lex or if my parents take the family to eat Brazillian). The last few times I've treated myself, my scalp was incredibly inflamed when I woke up. The feeling is almost like when you wear a hat all day and then take it off in the evening. Very interesting.
I didn't see your second question Howard,
I'm not a big fan of nuts. Mainly because they're loaded with carbs, most of them are thyroid inhibiting goitrogens and they contain my nemesis fiber.
I ate a lot of them in my paleo days and they always seemed to upset my stomach. For a while I had a serious almond butter problem... I was a straight up junky.
Thanks for commenting Debbie,
Keep in mind I'm not an expert, but if the thyroid doesn't start to pick up over a long period of time (years?) I would explore the idea of other elements inhibiting its performance (metals, yeast).
It's no surprise that your thyroid was okay when you were eating high carbs. Carbs are rocket fuel. Its when the rocket fuel is taken away and the body is allowed to normalize is when these metabolic problems begin to surface.
If you have no elemental or yeast problems, I would say time will sort it out. Lex Rooker, my 6 years carnivorous buddy, had radiation therapy on his thyroid and he's doing great. The bodies healing capabilities are really astounding.
Yes Danny i've also noticed the inflamed scalp along with increased sebum activity (greasy skin). Also Danny have you had any problems present or previous with yeast, candida etc this has been quite a stubborn problem for me to beat. How strict are you in regards to you're diet are you at the point where you no longer cheat at all? I know once I got passed the 3 month mark it was EASY didn't really even think about food at all and there was no need for any will power...but recently I have been cheating and realized just how difficult carbs are to kick.
I've been eating an exclusive fat & meat diet since July of 08. I've been eating pemmican about half that time. A "cheat" for me would be going out with my family for Brazilian BBQ (something I wouldn't normally do), but to be honest I really don't look at it like that.
I'm not sure about the yeast connection, but I do know that in Andy Cutler's book Amalgam Illness he says that those with heavy metal poisoning usually have some degree of yeast proliferation.
There is no doubt in my mind that carbohydrates are addictive and extremely difficult to give up.
Danny,
Again, your grip and understanding on hormones, glands and their interrelationships STUNS me.
OMG u totally ROCK!!
I'm glad you liked the thyroid stuff. Like you I'm still figuring out the whole adrenal, thyroid and heavy metal toxicity angles. One of my buddies David has worked with Dr. Klinghardt in regards to detox'ing and identifying adrenal and thyroid problems. We can have incident exposures from our mothers, amalgam (as you mentioned), living near or consuming toxic environmental pollutants (old lead paint circa 1960s 1970s; coal burning; farmed and wild seafood tuna etc). The scariest thing is that it can be from our water supply, e.g. chlorine, other halides like flouride;bromides from soda/veggie oils which shift and displace the iodine out of thyroid hormones and glands.
Check these out. Would love to hear your thoughts.
http://www.klinghardtneurobiology.com/HGToxicity09.pdf
There are protocols involving fluconazole not just for yeast but it apparently may affect the immune system positively (but liver tests should be followed). I know supplements and drugs are not very ancestral but every tribe had a healing or medicine person. With all the neolithic-derived toxicities I think certain supplements have great benefits. You know the gallbladder of bears is highly prized in China for its medicinal healing properties. You know what it has in it? High amounts of bile acids containing Taurine, an amino acid with powerful immune boosting and disease reversal effects. I think you might that cool... (I suspect u probably get plenty of taurine -- only found in RAW or rare meat and seafood; it is found to be depleted in hypothyroid and Grave's individuals)
http://www.molvis.org/molvis/v12/a195/
G
G,
Your thoughts mean so much to me. I cannot thank you enough for your kind words.
That PDF echoes a lot of what I've read from Andy Cutler and is a FANTASTIC resource, thank you! One of the main points that Andy stresses in his book, is not engaging in "single sessions" of chelation. Instead he recommends dosing every 3-4 hours with alpha lipoid acid and DMSA over a course of 3 days or so. Reading through the PDF makes me feel that I'm doing the right thing by restarting my chelation rounds.
The fluoride/bromide fiasco definitely had me worried for a while, I took Iodoral at a point in time, but It always made me feel worse, probably because my adrenals were still wacked. I don't worry too much about this now, since after dispelling the rumor of distilled water leeching minerals from your body, it's pretty much the only thing I drink. I'm not sure if ALA or DMSA have an effect on either bromide or fluoride.
Your comment about neolithic-derived toxicities is timely, I'm working on a post right now that talks about this exact same thing. Having the idea that I can eat like "grok" and be healthy - with lead in my bones - doesn't really jive.
That study on Bear bile is wild! Who knew there was even literature like that? What a find.
I hope you don't mind if I continue to use your blog as a reference. You truly are a gifted writer, with a great sense of humor.
Danny,
It's so funny... we are on a similar path of exploration!! The bear bile is cool beans isn't? I get my taurine from iHerb.com for like $7 bucks. (it's the bulk powder which looks like cocaine *haa* but I've never seen cocaine). No bear sacrifice necessary (though I heard it tastes delicious like pork). Absolutely -- please use any part of the blog you want. Actually I will be using some of yours! Hope that is ok! I have failed to discuss insulin b/c it is done so well elsewhere at your blog and many others.
Here is a link to David HERE. He is like you -- young, BRILLIANT, kind and always learning. The protocol from Dr. Klinghardt, please ask him about it. David has told me that one does have to exercise some caution -- we can pull the metals out but we don't want to have them redistributed (like in the brain).
For adrenal support, there are so many protocols and systems that help. My sister, her husband and I have all started Gaia's adrenal support (from Whole Foods, Vitamin Shoppe or any health food store) in the last 2 wks. WOWO it is excellent. We have all noticed calmness, improved sleep (my sister reduced her melatonin) and better well being. The herbal support synergistically work together and I like how it is in one capsule. I didn't do so hot with licorice root or ginseng (we're all different in our brain biochemistry I guess) which made my heart palpitate. Do you check your body temps and heart rates? Have you found value in reading Dr. Broda Barnes MD (advises high fat but a near-ketotic diet for thyroid)?
Thank you!
G
Oh BTW! Selenium ? Do you take enough? This mineral is vacant in our environment (just like Magnesium and Iodone). Selenium is incredibly crucial for glutathione and other enzymatic detox and energetic enzymes and metabolic pathways. Also Selenium alone was shown to lower anti-TPO in Hashimoto's hypothyroidism HERE. I take Selenium 200mcg daily from iHerb.com the NOW brand.
Vitamin E? Do you take enough? Again, this is completed depleted from food and environmental sources, plus we use it up quickly under oxidative stress situations (like hypothyroidism +/- hypoadrenals)... I take both (sometimes alternating, sometimes together) Gamma E and the Tocotrienol Complex (which has some extra Se) by NOW brand. One cannot take the alpha-tocopherol alone, it depletes out the more minuscule amounts of gamma and other tocopherols. In food, all the tocopherols and tocotrienols typically come together (esp in grassfed meat, wild seafood and palm oil and other 'reddish' colored oils). A really good friend advised the benefits of these (important to achieve prior to iodine repletion). I personally have found great value and believe they alone raised my body temps by at least half to one degree. Like you, I had some palps with iodone and had to initially stop it. I've gradually added back a little the last few wks and I am ok. I want to mega dose with Iodoral or Iosol (achieving Paleo levels of inhabitants that evolved shoreside near HIGH marine and oceanic mineral sources) but I'm waiting for my adrenals to plug back in!
G,
I seem to have strange reactions to many different "sound great on paper" supplements. Taurine is one of those supplements. While I've never had an amino acid analysis, I would assume that I have none because taurine is yet another amino that is depleted by stress. Evertime i would take it (in doses as small as 250 mg) I would become very cold. Andy Cutler has a section in Amalgam Illness where he states that taurine can cause hypoglycemic chills in some - maybe that was it.
I will check that link out when I get home from work. Keep em comin...
Ah! Thank you! I was racking my brain trying to remember the woman's name that recommended a high fat diet for thyroid problems. I had read about Dr. Broda Barnes a while ago and totally forgot.
I may look into adrenal supplementation, perhaps a adrenal cortex glandular product. I haven't had success in the past with adrenal products, but I think I've come a long way. I'll look into the Gaia product, it sounds interesting.
Like I said with the taurine, I'm so very sensitive to supplements. Besides making me a little tired the DMSA and ALA are some of the only acceptions to supplements that don't 1.) make my hair fall out 2.) give me anxiety 3.) give me... unusual bathroom habits. I spend the extra buck for grass fed meat to make my pemmican, so I guess it's possible I'm getting most of what I need. Hopefully I'm replacing minerals/aminos/vitamins faster than metals are destroying them.
It's so nice to talk to you about this G, we really seem to be on the same page!
Hey,
I hear ya -- if I take more then 2000 mg of Taurine I get dizzy (perhaps hypoglycemic?? thanks for that mention... I missed that adverse effect). My BP is like 80s/50s (*haa* and yeah I am alive). So taurine can be 'excessively' calming. I am kinda wary about glandular products (parasites? flukes? bovine related mad cow? etc). I am sure they have a place in therapy (like bear bile!) but I am not sure about purity and that kind of thing. Like you I am sensitive too -- too much Carnosine makes me dizzy and tired. Mag can give me cramps so I can only take it more once a wk but I supplement if I sweat a lot (literally I make salt crystals on my hats). However with fish oil, I grow gills! NO PROBLEM whatsoever with dosing. Broda Barnes does mention (and I found an article to back it up) protein can stimulate its own uptake -- which requires some T3 apparently. So if our thyroid is mildly depleted, consuming 'too much' protein can perhaps encourage more T3 synthesis (and further deplete thyroid?). That may be good, but perhaps if the raw materials and machinery to produce it aren't adequate at baseline yet, may be it is too much?
BTW I loved your hair loss post from May -- wish I had seen that like 3 yrs earlier when I had my synthetic hormone debacle (which probably jacked up my adrenals and thyroid)!!! Never too late though for me to understand my body and hormone cascades. I hope you figure the rest out soon! For my health! *HAA*
Hey G!
I think your right to be suspect of glandulars. While I see a lot of respectable professionals recommend them, I'm not sure the mechanism at which they work. If your adrenals are weak - does eating another animals adrenal cortex help? I have no idea. The proper strategy being of course to find the stressor and eliminate it. There are many anecdotal report of them being of benefit, but there are a lot of anecdotal "good" experiences with colloidal silver.
So explain, because this is very interesting. I always figured protein (moderate) was good for the thyroid. I remember when I made a "high protein pemmican" and shortly after I would have a warm sensation all over my body. At the time I figured this was because thermogenesis or maybe because thyroid hormones were kicked up because of extra tyrosine.
It would totally make sense though that this would be a stressful event to the thyroid. The excess protein is forcing the event to happen... I hope this makes sense. Did I understand correctly?
Thank you! Hair-loss is very near and dear to my heart. Its what got me initially started with caring about my health.....SO VAIN OF ME, but oh well look were I ended up. I have a hell of a lot more to learn. I'm thinking of writing an addendum to the hair loss post, because there are so many other avenues that hair loss can take place. Very, very interesting topic.
Hi Danny! Thought this would be the fastest way to get a hold of you. I've got one of those huge, 5 gallon buckets of U.S. Wellness Meat's Beef Tallow that I don't want anymore. I've used less than a quarter of it. Do you want it? For free even! I'm just not enjoying the pemmican lately.
Hey Deanna!
Thank you so much for the offer! Truth be told I threw my 5 gallon jug out because I got brutally sick last time I made pemmican from it. I simply don't trust US Wellness anymore. Thank you so much for the generous offer though, I hope you're well.
I follow Kurt's approach at PaNu (plus extra veggies when I eat dinner with my wife) and had similar concerns about "low-carb induced hypothyroidism", the down regulation of T3 on a calorie restricted diet, etc... At any rate, this stuff *is* fascinating to learn about.
After doing a bit of searching I eventually came across your blog. Just wanted to say I enjoyed the thoughtful post and look forward to reading more of your stuff.
Thanks for commenting Future Primitive,
I would follow Kurt off a cliff, that man is awesome.
I'm glad you enjoyed the article, I was sick of all the fear mongering about becoming hypothyroid when you go low carb. It seems to be a bunch of hogwash.
What's wrong with taking Armour thyroid? Why did you stop?
And why stop testostosterone, what are you testosterone numbers pre-post carnvore diet.
How long were you on Thyroid, HCG and testosterone? And what was your reason for going off them?
Thanks for commenting Brad,
I was on Armour thyroid for ~1 year, the same with testosterone (gel, then later test cyp) and only on HCG for about 6 months to "restart" my system.
I went off them because I needed to learn and figure out my underlining issues. Simply replacing hormones that were deficient in my body with pharmaceuticals didn't seem like a reasonable strategy to me.
Hello
I read your post with interest as I was looking for ammunition in my quest to defend people on VLC/ZC diets. I do not eat a VLC diet myself. I felt very unwell on such a regime (yes I persisted on it for a year) and eat general low carb now. But, I see people with thyroid issues succeeding on ZC so wanted to suss out this "evidence" that it damages the gland.
All I can say is that I do not believe ZC equates to fasting as, if it did it would be worrisome. The reason I say this is because of the quote above saying that hypothyroidism could be measured by the TSH test as a measure of hypothyroidism. The TSH test has failed thyroid patients for years, booth in diagnosis and treatment. Thankfully, there is a revolution against it now and doctors who actually understand the thyroid assess diagnosis and treatment by looking at levels of Free T4, Free T3 and antibodies. In fact, free T3 is the most important of all in terms of metabolism. There is also evidence that fasting leads to higher levels of reverse T3. Reverse T3 http://www.thyroid-rt3.com/whatis.htm basically blocks thyroid receptors and stops thyroid hormone from working properly. This accounts for the metabolic shutdown whereby patients cannot lose on even the lowest of calorie intakes. One really does not want their reverse T3 to be high or their T3 to be low.
With all the success of ZC'ers and VLC'ers I just do not think either of these regimes damages the thyroid. However, if ketogenic diets really do lower Free F3 that would mean people would be headed towards metabolic shutdown. I find this idea pretty unbelievable.
So, I do not think fasting is the same as VLC/ZC. From what you write here, I sure hope not!!!!